Help:FAQ

"Why is this site so rubbish?"
... and other burning questions ...

What's the point of the Mathematicians page?
"The name of this wiki is ProofWiki. Thus I wonder if it is really necessary for this wiki to take on a huge historical task? Does it have a realistic chance to do a good job? At this moment the lists are far from complete, but it is hard to expect good results. Others are doing it already. Perhaps any historian can support other, more history oriented projects. It'll be hard to outdo them anyway."


 * A good question to which the only answer is "because I like it." If you really want the mathematicians page to be removed because it doesn't suit your idea of what this site ought to be, or that you want me to stop wasting my time on it and concentrate on what you think I ought to be working on (please provide a work schedule that you wish me to adhere to), you'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands. --prime mover (talk) 06:51, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

I don't like the notation
"On such-and-such a page the notation is thus-and-so - I didn't like it, so I changed it to the notation I grew up with as a little boy back in the 1940's. It was good enough for Elijah, so it should be amply appropriate for you. But then - some rotten so-and-so changed it back!"


 * The world turns, life evolves, continents crumble to dust, and mathematicians occasionally devise notation which is considered an improvement over that which was originally invented.


 * It will forever be the case that there is more than one style of notation to illustrate a concept. The people who are familiar with notation A are going to complain if we use notation B, and those who grew up with notation B are going to be upset with our decision to use notation A. You can't please everyone.


 * Hence we choose a particular style, and we insist that all pages adhere to that particular style. This causes controversy, as followers of a particular symbol which has been turned down in favour of another, usually more modern, one which (in general) is less prone to ambiguity are going to be more or less offended.


 * So, if you don't like the particular notation that you see on a page, we are afraid that you are going to remain disappointed. If you have cogent reasons, and can articulate them well and in a polite manner, you may be listened to - but somebody will then need to be tasked with amending every single instance of the existing notation with your preferred. Such a task is tedious and time-consuming, and the maintenance team are in general antipathetic to such an eventuality. --prime mover (talk) 20:11, 30 December 2012 (UTC)


 * @Prime.mover : What are you so angry about? Why so many instances of rudeness on your part in this short comment?  You start from a presumption that if someone disagrees with you about notation, the only conceivable reason is that that person is wrong and that you're right and that the reason why they're wrong can only be that they're against progress and attached to former conventions, and that new conventions introduced on this web site that are not standard are necessarily superior to others that are standard.  Then you state that it will rarely happen that someone who disagrees with you will be able to articulate anything cogently.  It is unusual to encounter someone less acquainted with politeness than someone who writes in the way you did above.  Not to mention that if you go around telling people the instant you meet them that they're stupid if they disagree with you, you'll be wrong most of the time, and you'll drive away people from whose superior intellect you could benefit. Michael Hardy (talk) 01:10, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Surely you can see that it is impossible to please everyone with the choice of notation we use? This has often been a bone of contention in the past. Contributors have been genuinely angered when they have demanded that we amend our notation to match what they like, and we have stuck to our decision to use the one that we chose. What does it matter what notation is used as long as it is defined adequately? We have to fight this battle over and over again. You're just the latest in a stream of newcomers who drop in and take immediate issue with minor aspects of what they see as presentational deficiencies.


 * In order for us to decide to change a notational standard we need a good reason. The reason for this is that it takes a lot of work to go through all the pages and change them. Why such a change is "progress" beats me. It's not that I'm "right" and you're "wrong", but just that we have made a stylistic decision. The notations we use have not in general been "introduced" on this website - they have all been published before. Some of them are indeed (relative) innovations, in particularly the ones fairly recently publicised by Knuth. He presents a good case that the new style of presentation is an improvement over the variously encountered old styles, and so those styles have been adopted. --prime mover (talk) 06:32, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Nonetheless, everything that makes sense in what you said above can be said politely instead of the way you said it. Michael Hardy (talk) 20:19, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * On the page where you raised the question the wording was formally correct enough. This is an FAQ page where the response was in reply to a question which has been put tediously many times in tones ranging from peevishness to fury. Yours was just the kicker I needed to write that generic answer that has been bubbling for some time. --prime mover (talk) 20:30, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

You undid my corrections
"I read such-and-such a proof and didn't like it much. I had a better one, so I removed the existing rubbish proof and put my better one in place. I went back next day to admire my work but found it had gone, and the old proof was back in place."


 * Whether or not you like a particular proof or not is of zero relevance. The fact is: it's a proof, and (at least believed by its author) it's valid. What we do on this site is allow multiple proofs for any given theorem. So, rather than replace the existing proof with your own proof, add your new proof as an additional proof to the one that is already up there.


 * There are quite a few pages up now which do have more than one proof. An excellent example of this is found at Real Numbers are Uncountable. What we do is put each separate proof into its own subpage which is then transcluded into the main page.


 * Basically, deleting stuff is rude. If you have objections about something on a particular page, then feel free to raise it as a topic on the talk page. It is possible the person posting it up may just have made a mistake. --prime mover (talk) 07:46, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Why do we need and   with every pair of parentheses?
"Do we really need to put  for every parenthesis, even things like $\sin(2x)$ and $(2n)!$? Out of curiosity, what difference does the extra curly inside   make? It seems to display the same."


 * The curly braces are grouping indications for $\TeX$; they serve to ensure that every  is paired with the intended  . Especially when using an external editor (e.g. via the Firefox plug-in It's all text) that highlights matching braces, such can greatly simplify the frustrating search for an occasional omitted or excess brace.


 * We enforce it to avoid problems with copy-pasting and subsequent editing of stuff inside parentheses. In this way, the parentheses will always size appropriate to their content, even if that content vertically grows or shrinks due to changes.


 * Equation references like $(1)$ and $(3′)$ are excepted from this admittedly strict style rule. --Lord_Farin (talk) 17:57, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

Why a sentence on each line?
"I wrote a perfectly good dissertation, but then someone has come along and broken it up into simple kindergarten-level "the cat sat on the mat" style sentences, one on each line. This makes it look like a baby's first reader."


 * It makes it easier to follow a proof.


 * This is one of the more rigidly-enforced stylistic practices. Information is assimilated more easily if the flow of the argument is broken up into well-defined steps. In text books this practice is rarely seen, because that would increase the physical size of the book and the amount of paper it is printed on, hence the cost. This is why logical arguments in printed texts can be hard to follow.


 * On a website, there is no need to save space in this way. Therefore, we don't. We spread out the argument so it is as clear as possible.


 * (Little feedback has been received from the outside as to whether this approach has made the learning of mathematics in general easier as a result, but it may be worth setting up as a research project for anyone with a postgraduate degree to complete and a complete lack of inspiration on what to base the dissertation.) --prime mover (talk) 10:51, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

Why the extra blank line?
"I did an edit on a section of one of the pages, then after I'd done so, someone else came in and edited the page just to add an extra blank line at the end of the section. Isn't that a bit pointlessly silly?"


 * The house style is such that the sections on the pages are spread out more than usual. This is a deliberate design decision: research has shown that information is taken from a webpage with greater ease when it is spread out more widely than it is on printed material. I have no intention of searching for documentary info on the web to back this up - it's just something I learned when I had an involvement in professional web design.


 * To that end, two blank lines are inserted in every page (with a few specialised exceptions where breaking the rule improves the presentation) at the end of every section before the next (sub)header. This needs to be done deliberately by hand.


 * Unfortunately MediaWiki software, when you edit an individual section, not the full page, removes any extra blank lines at the end of that section, making it necessary to go back and edit that whole page again to add the line it removed.


 * As a consequence, editing an individual section of a page is discouraged. It should not matter too much, because the policy of this site is to keep pages small. There are few pages over ten thousand characters, and many of those have been flagged as candidates for refactoring anyway. --prime mover (talk) 10:51, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

Why bother to keep all those useless redirects?
"The name of such-and-such page has been changed from something that wasn't very meaningful to something that makes a lot more sense. But you're keeping the not-so-meaningful redirect. Why not just delete it and tidy up the site?"


 * Before a page is deleted, you need to make sure all the pages which link to it have their links changed to point to the new page. Otherwise you break the links. An easy way to do this is to select the link "What links here" in the Toolbox section in the menu bar down the left. Only when every page linking to this old unwanted redirect page have been so amended, and only then, is it okay to delete the page.


 * BUT: Even then, there may be external websites which may (however misguidedly) have a link to that page themselves. If this is the case, then their link to ProofWiki will be gone. And that is a Bad Thing.


 * If the page being renamed is new, however, e.g. you just wrote it then noticed a spello in the title, then (after the renaming) it is usual for that particular redirect to be deleted, as there has been little opportunity for the page to have been noticed by the outside world and linked to. --prime mover (talk) 12:29, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

What do you mean "sign your post"?
"I told you something interesting on one of the talk pages, but all I got was the terse response: "Please sign your post." What the factorial is that supposed to mean?!?!?"


 * The talk pages are where discussion of matters arising from the entry to which it is attached. Questions are raised concerning the meaning of that page, or why the notation was chosen as it was, or merely just to tell the person writing it that it's a load of rubbish and not worth the paper it's printed on.


 * As these pages are for discussion, it is useful to have a record of who said what, and when they said it, and to be able to follow the conversation.


 * So, whenever you enter a post on a talk page (not one of the main pages: definition or proof), you are required to sign your post. This is done by pressing the button at the top of the edit pane which contains a logo that looks like a squiggle. It should be the rightmost icon but one. What this will do is enter two hyphens followed by four tildes: . When you save that page, it will replace the four tildes with your user "signature" and the date at which it was posted, like you see at the end of this paragraph. Please do what you can to honour this request. --prime mover (talk) 17:38, 27 December 2012 (UTC)